VQ upgrades

scaleman · Post by **scaleman** » Sun Dec 28, 2008 3:57 pm

Hello everybody! Hey I Purchased my VQ Sear and Trigger. What would be the benifit of me Purchasing a new hammer? Someone told me or I read that when they changed their hammer with the VQ it cause alot of misfires. Is this the case. Also Im on a budget but want to get a scope for my Ruger MK III. I want to keep it around 50-60 bucks if possible. What would you all suggest?Has anybody used one of these Leapers Red Dots? I just do some light target shooting and some plinking. Thanks Scaleman

Bud33 · Post by **Bud33** » Sun Dec 28, 2008 7:04 pm

I have installed a VQ hammer in my MK III 22/45 and have never had a FTF up to this point.
I also bought a BSA Red dot for about $30 and it has served me well.
It is not the best scope but it is good enough for casual shooting.
Just MHO

scaleman · Post by **scaleman** » Sun Dec 28, 2008 7:13 pm

Thanks what benifit does the VQ hammer offer?

SKnight · Post by **SKnight** » Sun Dec 28, 2008 11:26 pm

It's lighter, meaning it's going faster when it hits the transfer bar. There's probably more but I'm not sure of the rest. With the VQ hammer installed I started getting deeper dents in the spent cases, so it is hitting a little harder, but I never had a FTF that was from a light strike. All the cases were smacked pretty well.

FTF seems to be ammo prone thus far for me. Cheapest stuff Wal Mart has Federal has been the best thus far. Two duds in 1650 rounds, and very consistant accuracy. Winchester isn't consistant accuracy wise, and has about a 5% FTF rate. Turn the bullet, and it will usually go off, indication of a quality control issue in the primer dept.

Remington isn't worth throwing in a fire to me. 10-12% FTF rate. Started taking the duds home, pulling the slugs and powder out, then smacking the brass with a hammer, no pops or bangs. I really like their centerfire rounds, but you couldn't give me the rimfire.

This of course, is my opinion. Weapons vary, so yours might love Remington or Winchester. I got lucky, my Mark III loves the cheap stuff. YMMV, all the usual disclaimers.

recumbent · Post by **recumbent** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 6:12 am

Remington isn't worth throwing in a fire to me. 10-12% FTF rate. Started taking the duds home, pulling the slugs and powder out, then smacking the brass with a hammer, no pops or bangs. I really like their centerfire rounds, but you couldn't give me the rimfire.

I agree Remington 22 ammo is Junk.

OpsMgr · Post by **OpsMgr** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 7:46 am

Stay away from the Remmy ammo - Use Federal or CCI instead.

The VQ sear and trigger are all that is needed IMO - Hammer does not add much...

scaleman · Post by **scaleman** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 8:45 am

Yeah all I use is Federal bulk or CCI. My Savage Mark II Loves the Federal Bulk. I had purchased a box of Golden Bullets once and they jammed on the second to last bullet every clip, and the FTF rate was high. I gave them away they werent worth messing with.
I think I save the hammer for when I have nothing else to do to the gun. Right now there is plenty to do. #1 learn to Shoot it better!

Thanks for any input you have given, this is why I love this site!

DancesWithSquirrels · Post by **DancesWithSquirrels** » Wed Dec 31, 2008 9:20 am

I installed the VQ hammer along with the trigger and sear when I was doing my upgrades. I had no choice in the matter due to a butcher job by a so-called gunsmith which is documented in a thread somewhere else on this forum. I have had no problems with the hammer causing light strikes. The performance of the the ammo I use has not changed. I love CCI standard velocity and have had only one or two FTF's in thoushands of rounds fired. I agree with everybody who says the Remington stuff is not reliable. I had less problems with Winchester but still had more FTF's than I would like. Haven't used much Federal stuff.

DWS

scaleman · Post by **scaleman** » Wed Dec 31, 2008 10:59 am

I do remember reading that thread. Now here is another question. Most of the stores around here only carry HV ammo, so I would have to order SV. Why would I want to use a SV vs. HV in my MKIII.

My rifle loves the HV 40g round. I can get under .5" groups all day at 50 yards with the CCI and federal of ammo. It does not like anyother brands or weight's that I have tried. It doesnt even like the green tag ammo, good for me I guess.

I am tring to understand bullistics a bit more these days. Its not lets go shoot some cans for me anymore. Bullseye do you have an article on bullistics. I love your articles, they are easy and to the point.

I was told by CCI that they own and make federal ammo at the same plant!

Post by **Bullseye** » Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:27 pm

I do remember reading that thread. Now here is another question. Most of the stores around here only carry HV ammo, so I would have to order SV. Why would I want to use a SV vs. HV in my MKIII.

The whole idea behind a lower velocity ammo is a reduced recoil. A tamer recoil means more time the front sight has on target, less time recovering between shots, and that makes those rapid fire bullseye strings theoretically more accurate. The trade of is ensuring that the lowest velocity possible ammo will cycle the action 100%. Otherwise you'll have to spend that newly recovered target time in alibi strings - which could end up being a poor investment.

CCI and Federal are indeed made at the same ammunition plant owned by ATK. CCI-SV and CCI-Green Tag are made on the same loading machines. The Green Tag is the ammo that passes through tighter quality control standards. Both versions are very good ammo to shoot.

Do you have any specific questions about ballistics?

Here are some tables depicting .22 HV and SV bullet drop rates.

High Velocity ammo

Standard Velocity ammo

Perhaps this is a good place to start formulating your questions.

Hope this helps.

R,
Bullseye

scaleman · Post by **scaleman** » Wed Dec 31, 2008 1:27 pm

I want to apologize for my ignorance on this subject. You are a great instructor Bulleye and the rest of the group is also great with their wealth of info.

A reduced Recoil Equaling greater accuracy makes a whole lot of sense to me. So here are my questions.

1. Why doesnt the bullet start at 0" on the graph? Does it lift during flight is that what I am seeing? Or is that just the projectory of the fire arm?

2. Bullet drop is how much the projectile will fall at a certian distance right? so like 5" at 100 yards for the SV.

3. what does the NZ, MT, FZ, PBR stand for

Im sure I can think of more but I save it for later.

DancesWithSquirrels · Post by **DancesWithSquirrels** » Wed Dec 31, 2008 2:31 pm

scaleman,

Any time a particular bullet is zeroed in at a particular range it will cross the line of sight twice. Once on the way up and once on the way down. Remember the barrel of the gun is normally below the line of sight when sighting in.

The NZ is the near zero and the FZ is the far zero. MT is the mid-range trajectory. This will be the high point of the bullet's travel. PBR I am drawing a blank on.

You can look at bullet drop a couple of ways but essentially a bullet begins dropping from the straight line of the bore axis as soon as it leaves the barrel. But most of the time you want to consider bullet drop in relation to some particular point along its trajectory such as the far zero point.

DWS

Post by **Bullseye** » Wed Dec 31, 2008 2:33 pm

1. Why doesn't the bullet start at 0" on the graph? Does it lift during flight is that what I am seeing? Or is that just the projectory of the fire arm?

The firearm has to be aimed with the muzzle slightly elevated to have the bullet strike the target accordingly by line of sight of the shooter. The graph shows the optimum aiming radius (point blank range) as one inch. (+/- .5" above and below the zero line) The zero line represents the line of sight of the shooter as seen through the firearm's sights.

A bullet's decent is affected by the pull of gravity just like any other object's mass. It drops at the same rate as anything else - gravity is a constant force. If you dropped a pen at the firing line at the exact same height and instant as the bullet exits the barrel (when the barrel is aimed perfectly parallel to the ground) both objects would strike the ground at the same instant. The difference being that the bullet will have traveled a considerable distance from the originating point when it hits the ground due to its velocity.

2. Bullet drop is how much the projectile will fall at a certain distance right? so like 5" at 100 yards for the SV.

Correct, based on the aiming point and elevation of the bore of the firearm.

3. what does the NZ, MT, FZ, PBR stand for?

NZ= Near Zero range: or the distance where the bullet passes through the aiming point on its upward path of trajectory.

MT= Maximum Trajectory range: or the apogee of the bullet in its flight based on the aiming of the pistol's barrel and sights.

FZ = Far Zero range: or the distance where the bullet passes through the aiming point on its downward path of trajectory.

PBR = Point Blank Range: this is the distance whereby the bullet stays with in the one inch radius. (yellow shaded line)

Hope this helps.

R,
Bullseye

scaleman · Post by **scaleman** » Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:42 pm

Ok so the yellow area is what I see in my sight, and where the radius starts is the center of my muzzle is that right?

Post by **Bullseye** » Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:48 pm

Yes, basically that is so. The radius is the line of sight to your aiming point. The offset is shown on the chart as a one inch yellow line.

R,
Bullseye