Carry-Ability gun

bearandoldman · Post by **bearandoldman** » Mon Jan 11, 2010 11:10 am

greener wrote:Spent some time at the gun show looking at small .380 and 9mm pistols.
Taurus has a new .380, the TCP 738 that competes with the LCP and P3AT in size and price. Good feel and the trigger seems to be smooth an not all that heavy.
None of these are pistols I'd like to have extended range sessions with. They aren't intended for that. If I were in the market for one, I'd probably go with the Keltec's simply on price.
I may end up with one but, at least for this weekend, I couldn't get over the thought that small, light and pocket-size was the reason I have an S&W 442.

Got to agree with you on that range session, 2 mags full is usually enough for the day and then do it before you leave or you may get flinch. My P3AT, gets a little exercise every few months , it is basically my weak side back up gun. Accuracy is in the 2 minute of felon range at S/D distances, 12 holes in a n 8 inch circle is enough to discourage mot any Bad Guy. As far as cost the KelTec is a good bargain, the other guns as far as
I can see do not have any added advantages.

quickslider · Post by **quickslider** » Mon Jan 11, 2010 8:08 pm

I just purchased the new Taurus 380 as a pocket pistol. Over the weekenf I shot three different kinds of ammo with no failures. At 15 yards it would shoot 4 inch groups. In my eyes its's better made than KelTec and compares to the Ruger LCP. Ruger charges $25 for the second mag while Taurus provides two with the gun.

bearandoldman · Post by **bearandoldman** » Mon Jan 11, 2010 8:25 pm

quickslider wrote:I just purchased the new Taurus 380 as a pocket pistol. Over the weekenf I shot three different kinds of ammo with no failures. At 15 yards it would shoot 4 inch groups. In my eyes its's better made than KelTec and compares to the Ruger LCP. Ruger charges $25 for the second mag while Taurus provides two with the gun.

Neer triedshooting the KelTec by aiming, always figured it is a point and shoot under 10 yard gun to save my butt.

Hakaman · Post by **Hakaman** » Mon Jan 11, 2010 9:28 pm

there's some neat "small guns" out there, but I am really happy with my Kahr PM-9. For a small gun, it shoots quite accurately, even with me on the trigger.
GA

HEADKNOCKER · Post by **HEADKNOCKER** » Wed Jan 13, 2010 1:00 am

These are my Favorite "All Around Carry Guns"
1) The Smith & Wesson Model 642 Airweight in 38spl & 9mm, I have a 9mm cylinder fit to this 642 making it a 942
2) The Smith & Wesson 940 9mm para Centennial
3) The Glock 19 RTF2
Any of these three 9mms can be carried pretty well any time but I find myself carrying the Airweight in my front pocket the most in a slim little pocket holster..
I realy don't think there's ever been a better "Bug" than a J Frame Centennial & If there is I haven't found it yet..
Of Course there's smaller lighter pieces but most are little autos in sub par calibers that realy can't be relied apon to function 100% of the time..
Gary/Hk
S&W M642/942, M940 & Glock M19 RTF2

greener · Post by **greener** » Wed Jan 13, 2010 5:04 am

Nice. I hadn't thought about the 9mm revolvers or adding the cylinder to an X42 to make it a 9mm.

Hakaman · Post by **Hakaman** » Wed Jan 13, 2010 3:19 pm

Nice arrangement hk, I suppose the revolver has got to be the most dependable style out there. One of the things that I am pleased about with the Kahr PM9 is it's weight and size, I literally forget it is in my pocket. I usually carry my wallet in my front pocket, unless of course, I am carrying the kahr. So I guess I could say that I have had some experience with weight in my front pocket, making it a non-issue for me.
Thanks for the photo,
haka

HEADKNOCKER · Post by **HEADKNOCKER** » Wed Jan 13, 2010 3:25 pm

The 940 & there extra cylinders are "Hard To Find"
Just thought I'd through that option out there as it "Works For Me"
The full moon clips make them a breaze to load
There's several guys at the S&W Forum who have had thier Airweights & AirLites reamed to 9mm & cut for the moon clips but once that's been done shooting the original 38/357 realy isn't an option as the brass fire forms to the cylinder & the cases stick..
My convertion of the 642 was done by fileing the ratchet of the 9mm cylinder to work with the original hand & the endshake was set by useing "Power Custom" endshake shims to make the 9mm cylinder fit with the 38spls yolk/crane there bye makeing it a convertable, I got lucky & traded a Alessi Shoulder Holster for the 940-1 cylinder, I was even luckier to pick the holster up at a gunshow for a few dollars.
S&W also made a M547 K frame 9mm revolver that's a 6 shot, I had one of those but sold it around Christmas time, They were available in 3" RB & 4" SB, They don't use moon clips but unique extractor segments to extract spent cases..
Thanks & Good Luck in Your Quest!!
Gary

bgreenea3 · Post by **bgreenea3** » Thu Jan 14, 2010 12:09 am

any accuracy problem with a 9mm (.355) bullet in a 38spl (.357) bore? I know geeener had that issue in his Blackhawk convertable

Hakaman · Post by **Hakaman** » Thu Jan 14, 2010 7:11 am

any accuracy problem with a 9mm (.355) bullet in a 38spl

This may not pertain to the topic at hand, but, my Ruger BHC 45 is pulling way to the left with the 45acp?. I am using reloaded ammo, nothing fancy, and have the rear sight over to the right quite a bit. I shot from the bench rest position and the problem still existed. The gun has had some work done on it and is ready to be picked up from the gunsmith tonight. I had him ream out the cylinders(two of them), put an 11 deg forcing cone in, do a trigger job(I didn't think it needed one, but he said he could sing 3 verses of "she'll be coming around the mountain" before the gun fired), straiten the front sight(he said it was crooked), put a "hot pink" front sight dot(painted, I guess), and even out the muzzle crown. Maybe the shooting will straiten out with all this work done to it. It can't be me! I'll have to post a picture of it tonight, with all the fancy stuff done. This gun likes the lime light, it' a showoff.
Haka

bgreenea3 · Post by **bgreenea3** » Thu Jan 14, 2010 4:22 pm

Unless the little bit of freebore the acp has is mucking things up there shouldn't be much of a difference in how they shoot modest 45colt loads and standard 45 acp loads are quite simalar in weight and Velocity and Identical in diameter.....but looks like you had a BUNCH of work done to it, so it may shoot better.....why did it need so much done to it? or are you just out to stimulate your gunsmith's economy?

Hakaman · Post by **Hakaman** » Thu Jan 14, 2010 6:17 pm

why did it need so much done to it? or are you just out to stimulate your gunsmith's economy?

Ruger front sight is hard to see for me. It is an Iron sight, of course, and it is "black". It blends in with the rear sight and I lose focus. The gunsmith installed a fiber optic insert into the stationary front sight. Looks good now, and I can actually see the front sight. He also did his infamous trigger job on it, replacing the trigger spring, and polishing some parts inside, resulting in a nice sweet trigger pull. (not sure the poundage?). I shoot lead reloads, and get leading issues in the barrel. So he beveled a throat in it and beveled the rifling to accept lead bullets better. It cuts down on leading issues. The crown on the muzzle was poorly beveled, and he machined a nicer crown on it. He also reamed out the 45lc cylinder to accept rounds better, some rounds were actually not fitting into the cylinder easiy. He wanted to do the 45acp, the cylinder that is giving me occasional trouble getting some rounds to slide in, but said the cylinder chambers were too out of round to ream. He suggested I call Ruger on this issue and tell them the difficulty I have getting some rounds to load. I have only noticed this with remanufactured ammo, not with quality ammo. I will have to double check this issue with store bought ammo. He also said the front sight was slightly bent and adjusted it.
Haka
The gun feels good right now with the new trigger, can't wait to try it.

bgreenea3 · Post by **bgreenea3** » Thu Jan 14, 2010 7:01 pm

the 11 degree forcing cone helps with leading? All i shoot is lead relaods, and as long as the bullets are hard enough and not pushed too fast i haven't had any trouble with leading...maybe I'm lucky in this. I thought the 11 deg forcing cone helps with accuracy because the bullets they encounter the rifling and reduce the forcing cone from shaving lead from the bullets....

I have noticed that rugers are tight chambered though

Hakaman · Post by **Hakaman** » Thu Jan 14, 2010 7:22 pm

Well, maybe I didn't explain it right, but it does improve accuracy(the more the merrier for me), and according to him, does reduce leading.
An 11 degree angle will indeed help funnel the bullet down the barrel. But IMHO the great benefit of recutting a forcing cone is removing the tool marks from the factory cone. A small rough cone will act like a file scraping metal from the bullet as it passes. Some factory cones look like they have been cut with a cast iron burr.
He did machine in Taylor Throating as well as the forcing cone
Taylor throating removes the rifling and produces a good cone, plus a long throat that is in effect a "free bore". The bullet travels at least it's own length after leaving the cylinder and before engaging the rifling. I have never done it. I have some friends that have, and some say they have seen an improvement in accuracy and others say they have not seen a change.
I have been very satisfied with the 11 degree cone I cut with the Powers/Brownells tool and have not felt the need to invest more money in tools to cut the Taylor Throat. However, Jim Taylor swears by the positive effect of the throat developed and named by his father. Jim's opinion on sixgun matters should never be dismissed as he does know what he is talking about.
I got this info from another forum
GA

Hakaman · Post by **Hakaman** » Fri Jan 15, 2010 11:33 pm

Here is the response of a fellow who had to send his PM-9 back to Kahr, "twice", to get it repaired:

Well about 10 minutes ago FedEx just delivered my PM9. The report says, " replaced ejector, mag catch. Lubed test fired good".
I mentioned that I just got my PM9 back from Kahr for the second time. I just got back from the range and I fired the following type and quantity of ammo:
Remington UMC 115g 35 rounds
Fed Hydra Shok 124g 30 rounds
PMC 115g 100 rounds
I had NO ISSUES!!!!!!!.
This is the first trip to the range that was problem free.
The Kahr service report stated that they replaced the Ejector, and the Mag Catch.
After returning from the range I opened it up to clean and lube. Much to my surprise they gave me a totally new slide assembly. I am very happy to have a working PM9 but I don't understand why they wouldn't tell me they gave me a new entire slide assembly?
I now feel confident in using this PM9 as my primary carry weapon.

Haka