Once used brass and a blown up gun

Coach1 · Post by **Coach1** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:50 pm

Hi y'all. This may be tiresome old news for most of you but I will relay what happened last weekend.. a first for me. My son-in-law & I were at our favorite outdoor range last Saturday. He was punching holes in a target at 10 yards next to me when he suddenly backed off the firing line, dropped his relatively new Sig 1911 XO in .45 and hollered while holding his hand. I thought he got a bad slide bite. Turned out that his gun grip exploded in his hand! The mag dropped out of the frame (as expected). The next round had a good sized dent in the side of the casing, the right side grip panel (he's a lefty) split open and left the gun. We found the spent casing. It looked like it was sliced open at the extractor rim about half way around the circumference.

After confirming his hand was only hurt... no cuts, blisters or lost fingers... we took the gun and casing to our favorite gun store for an assessment. The round was a reload my S-i-L bought in bulk at the last local gun show in January. He shot about 25% of the can. The rest is being returned this weekend.

The gun shop tech said the slide was also cracked near the extractor. They will contact Sig this week to see what , if anything, they will do. The gun is about 4 months old. Perhaps the fact that John's hand is still only sore is a testament to the strength of Sig Sauer handguns.

I will update this with news as we get it. But one thing is assured, John and I are staying away from gun show reloads. Factory New is first choice. And I know all you home reloaders will campaign for your hobby.. but neither of us is into that skill / investment as yet.

ruger22 · Post by **ruger22** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:53 pm

Thank the Lord no one had serious injury. Most reloaders I've known have good confidence in their own work, a lot less in reloads done by someone else, especially done for resale.

My brother is an example of self-confidence not being enough. Split a case in a large bore revolver, I think .357, and got a permanent case of tinnitus. Could have happened with factory new ammo too, sure, but he got doubly careful and cautious with his own reloads.

Best of luck with Sig, and keep us posted.

Post by **Bullseye** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 5:00 pm

I've seen this happen several times too. Usually the rounds are improperly loaded over OAL. The resulting detonation blows out the grip panels as you've described and tears up the extractor and slide. Basically the case was unsupported during detonation. I've also seen this one with a S&W Model 52, again with similar results. More than a few folks with blackened palms from the handgrip blowout. Makes for quite a tingly feeling in the shooting hand.

R,
Bullseye

bgreenea3 · Post by **bgreenea3** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 5:04 pm

http://www.guntalk-online.com/forum/vie ... rus+kaboom

looked kinda like this? no damage to the gun or shooter on this one.....

your description sound a lot like what happened in thiis thread.

bigfatdave · Post by **bigfatdave** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 6:31 pm

scary stuff!
There are only a few people in the world I'd trust to reload for me, "ronnie reloader" at the gunshow isn't one of them, unless I'm putting the rounds into "danny dremel's" gun, anyway.

Considering that proof loads are well over factory/SAMMI spec, it takes quite a screwed-up load to explodinate a proofed gun (Sigs are proofed, right?).

Pics for educational purposes would be appreciated, as would the name of the reloading shop and how they handle this complaint.

What kind of grips did it launch? I'm wondering if I'm getting any extra protection from my alumagrips.

blue68f100 · Post by **blue68f100** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 6:36 pm

Glad no one was seriously hurt. I have heard of both reloads and factory ammo doing it from time to time. More common than I would want hear.

Sig's have a reputation for being stout, particularly with the SS slides.

greener · Post by **greener** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 7:21 pm

Did you get these from someone like Georgia Arms or Mac's Reloads? Not sure who shows up in Raleigh.

bgreenea3 · Post by **bgreenea3** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 8:20 pm

bigfatdave wrote:scary stuff!
There are only a few people in the world I'd trust to reload for me, "ronnie reloader" at the gunshow isn't one of them, unless I'm putting the rounds into "danny dremel's" gun, anyway.

Considering that proof loads are well over factory/SAMMI spec, it takes quite a screwed-up load to explodinate a proofed gun (Sigs are proofed, right?).

Pics for educational purposes would be appreciated, as would the name of the reloading shop and how they handle this complaint.

What kind of grips did it launch? I'm wondering if I'm getting any extra protection from my alumagrips.

Greeners had rubber houges and it absorbs the shock well.

bigfatdave · Post by **bigfatdave** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:45 pm

bgreenea3 wrote:Greeners had rubber houges and it absorbs the shock well.

Internal or external shocks, boss?

greener · Post by **greener** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 10:12 pm

bigfatdave wrote:
bgreenea3 wrote:Greeners had rubber houges and it absorbs the shock well.
Internal or external shocks, boss?

External, the rest is Taurus tough.

Post by **Bullseye** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 10:49 pm

Pachmayr 1911 grips, with the metal plates in them, absorb out of battery detonations fairly well too. While the panels will be knocked off they protect the hand from the blast effect.

R,
Bullseye

bigfatdave · Post by **bigfatdave** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:46 am

Bullseye, what about the alumagrips?
I'm thinking the weak point will be the threaded connectors (bushings or the screws themselves, not sure which) but once things open up there still could be blast at the grips' edges as they pop off, right?

Coach1 · Post by **Coach1** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 12:02 pm

Many thanks to all for the comments and concern for a fellow shooter's safety. And my son-in-law was wearing eye protection when this happened. We are serious about being "Safe out there". He said he may have to wear shooting gloves (suggestions anyone?) for a bit to protect that bruised hand and .. maybe get the confidence level up to where it was. Anyone that has had a gun blow up will say it has an affect on one's nerves a bit. We have not heard from the local gun shop / Sig as yet ... but worst case is he will buy a new slide and grip panels once the smith confirms no other damages.

To respond to a few of the questions above. ( I haven't figured out how to do the Quote bit yet).
* The picture on the referenced thread - the left hand casing looks very similar. Butt the next round in the mag had a dent in its casing - not the bullet.
* The reloads were bought from Sillman Cartridge at the NC Fairgrounds show. http://www.sillmancartridgecompany.com. They seem to be a repuyable NC based company. We will see what response we get at this weekend's show. They will have a booth there. We bought reloads and new factory ammo from Georgia Arms at prior shows and had No problems.
* The blown up casing ejected as expected and John said he registered the target hit at the same instant the gun exploded. That leads me to think this may not be exactly the same situation as the referenced thread.
* I thought that a double load .. or a too weak load .. might have been the issue rather than not going fully into battery.
* John is sort of obsessive about keeping all his hand guns clean and well maintained. A dirty gun was definitely not a consideration here.
* The grips were the Sig delivered plastic. Black to match the XO finish. We talked about changing them regardless of what Sig does for him. Alumagrips or Pachmayr are or first consideration. The right hand panel split down the middle - not quite top to bottom... along the plane of the panel screws. The screws remained in the frame but the panel ended up 3 feet from the gun.
* I will try to get some photos as soon as we can. John kept the blown up casing but the gun, slide & panel are with the shop for now.

Thanks again for all your interest and commentary. Will keep y'all posted.

ruger22 · Post by **ruger22** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 2:10 pm

bigfatdave wrote: it takes quite a screwed-up load to explodinate a proofed gun (Sigs are proofed, right?

If "Explodinate" isn't a real word, it should be. It sounds like what it describes!

bgreenea3 · Post by **bgreenea3** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 2:21 pm

these are what greener has on his pt1911 they held up well to the kaboom.

BFD I think the alumagrip would work in a simalar fashion.

wheather the gun was clean or not there could have been some gunk in the chamber (maybe some shaved lead) or it was just a weak casing

and i like explodinate too

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Once used brass and a blown up gun

Once used brass and a blown up gun

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